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Neighbours Leaving Bags Of Dog Faeces On My Doorstep

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#1
ravenswood67

Posted 12 March 2014 - 09:50 AM

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Hi all

 

I have lived in my flat for 5 years, its a housing association property.  The couple who live in the flat upstairs from me own their flat and they seem to think it gives them some kind of precedence.  Since I moved in they have never been very nice to me. I had NFH before, violent and noisy people and it took me 10 years and a whole load of health problems because of it before they were finally evicted and I was rehoused and I wanted to make a new start in a peaceful home. 

 

Four years ago I met my fiance and he moved in with me just last year.  A few weeks after he moved in (around September) my neighbour approached me and said that my dog had been fouling the communal gardens (he's 7 years old, so I already had him when I moved in and I always pick up after him).  A lot of cats use the gardens as a toilet pretty regularly and some dogs too.  She showed me where the fouling was and, although I was surprised that I had missed it, I apologised and cleaned it up.  She called me dirty and disgusting which upset me but I didn't want to spark a confrontation so I let it be. 

 

Since then I have stopped my dog going into the garden at all and he's walked 3 times a day.  However, just before Christmas I saw the same neighbour putting something on the ground in front of our dustbin and when I went out to look there was a huge pile of animal faeces there.  I knew it wasn't anything to do with my dog and stupidly assumed that she was cleaning up after all the cats (I've often had to do the same thing).  It was my finace who pointed out that she had left it there deliberately but I suppose I didn't want to pursue it after everything I'd been through with my previous neighbours.  That fight really left me exhausted (I'm sure many of you here have experienced yourselves how devastating it is) and I couldn't face another.

 

In January my fiance's family suffered a bereavement and my fiance was away for a week.  During that week I found more faeces left on the path in front of my door.  Sorry to be graphic but it wasn't fresh - it was dried so I knew it had to have been put there by someone.  Again, stupidly, I let it go.

 

Then last week members of my family came to visit us and found a bag full of animal faeces dumped on our doorstep.  I guess I finally snapped, went to their door and confronted them (I wasn't abusive I just asked them if they were responsible) and they admitted to it.  They said that despite my being 'warned' by them before that the fouling had continued.  I explained that it had continued because of the cats but they refused to listen, saying that it was my dog, that I am lazy, that I don't work and they do.  They then called my fiance a racist name (he's Northern English?) and at that point I went inside and reported it to my housing officer who is going to visit them and has also informed our hate crime unit and the police.

 

The neighbours must have been informed that they've been reported because this morning she started a campaign of provocative behaviour - deliberately leaving our gate open (we have a polite notice asking people to close it because the postman and dustmen tend to leave it open and I worry that my dog could get out onto the road) and hoovering loudly at 6.30 am. 

 

I've been thinking about their behaviour towards me since I moved in and its dawned on me that I've been bullied by them from the start - things like taking up all the space on the communal washing line (an elderly lady next door once pointed out to her that the lines weren't just for them and the NFH's reply was that she didn't see anyone's name on it), refusing to fix a leak that flooded my bathroom (they were forced to fix it in the end because it had got into my electrics and was dripping over my meter and fuse box) their apology was 'shit happens'. 

 

I now feel worried that I did the wrong thing by reporting them but my fiance says they left us with little choice.

 

I felt anxious today for the first time in a very long time which is why I've turned to this site, you were all so helpful before and I valued the support very much.  I'm under a different name now but I'm very grateful for you all.

 

I don't think I have it in me to go through a long war again, I just want peace and quiet.  I've tried so hard to make sure that I and my dog never impact negatively on anyone - I know only too well what that's like. 


Edited by ravenswood67, 12 March 2014 - 09:55 AM.


#2
celestina

Posted 12 March 2014 - 10:24 AM

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Hi and welcome again. I am so sorry to hear this. Dogs need to go somewhere and you are responsible and pick up after your dog - this is all you can do and is perfectly legal. Your neighbours leaving bags on your doorstep is not - you are right, it's harassment. Take photo's and log all incidents. You are not responsible for the cat population.

 

Try not to retaliate - approaching your neighbour sounds futile, leave it up to the council and wait to see how they deal with it first.

 

Keep logging, taking photo's and ignore. Check your gate is closed before letting your dog out and don't let her see that any of it bothers you.

 

I am sure someone will be along shortly with some more suggestions for you, take care and your dog sounds lovely.


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'The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing' (Edmund Burke)

#3
Crezz1

Posted 12 March 2014 - 10:43 AM

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Hello and welcome, like you said we are all here to help each other.


I would have done the same thing I would have gone round and confronted at at this point, however from now on don't, ok what they are doing is totally wrong, and I'm 100% with you on that.

I'm assuming that this is bagged up and placed there. Let's turn it round a moment... If they have spent their time shovelling [email protected] into a bag and placing on ur door step who's the fool here not you. Personally I would either ignore and report they will soon get fed up of doing this (I would) no reaction will soon annoy them.

Or I would put a note on it returning it to their door step, thanking them for there time, energy, and efforts in keeping the garden clean, I wanted to thank you for your envalueable efforts and you are doing a marvelous job, however could you kindly place in the bins provided, whilst I appreciate no one had notice your efforts in doing this I can only presume you place this on my door step so that we can acknowledge and show you our appreciation, hence the return of this bag.

Xx
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#4
celestina

Posted 12 March 2014 - 11:11 AM

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Ouch Crezz, that would really wind her up...lol  Absolutely, always be polite and nice - take copies of the note and a photo of course of it in situ by her door - if you decide to do this.  

 

It's always a gamble - once NFH get the bit between their teeth they can be relentless but on the other hand, they also need to be challenged.


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'The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing' (Edmund Burke)

#5
Geoman

Posted 12 March 2014 - 03:08 PM

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If it's possible then you could put up a cctv camera that covers your doorstep (not the garden if it's communal) so if any packages are put there you will catch them at it. Then again if they have admitted it already, this may not achieve much but might act as a deterrent. 

 

The problem with NFH (or one of the problems) is that they have a sense of entitlement. They think they are entitled to do anything, say anything and take anything they like whilst the rest of the population must do as they say. They can behave in anyway that they like but do something that annoys them (no matter how small) and they will shout and scream to anyone that will listen.

 

It's unlikely that their behaviour towards you will change and with communal space that could cause a lot of stress. Plus, living above you they could cause an awful lot of problems. If you have the energy, you can fight back via the HA and authorities and try to get them stopped or evicted or you could ask to be moved. Moving is no guarantee that you wont end up with another problem neighbour but if you were offered another flat, at least you could have a good look at the neighbours first.


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#6
fullcircle

Posted 12 March 2014 - 07:03 PM

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 hence the return of this bag.
 

 

 

 

This might be seen as harassment, they will deny they put it there on your door step, if you put a note with it, it will be evident you left it there,

 

my neighbour throws her dogs faeces in my garden so I know how disgusted it makes you feel,

 

the advantage you have is that they are walking around for hours, picking up someone else's dogs poo , to put it in a bag, so that they can leave it on your door step, probably in the middle of the night, so that they don't get caught, when you and every body else are tucked up in a warm bed.    :) 

 

the above crosses my mind, when I see this in my garden or if I see that they have rifled through my wheelie bin or put a dead rat under the wheel of my car, it makes me think, would I lose a nights sleep and worry whether or not if I had been seen, just to do something so pathetic, which has no real impact to my life, my answer would always be.......definitely not  :D  give me the warm bed every time, and I will report them in the morning.


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For 14 years I've heard, trust us we'll fix it, but I am still waiting filled with empty promises.
14 years of my CCTV, of nfh causing criminal damage, abuse,lies, assault, and not one conviction,why?
If the Law is the same for everyone, why does the outcome depend on who you are?


#7
angee

Posted 12 March 2014 - 09:55 PM

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Putting the bagged faeces in her letterbox without a note might be more fun ... LOL   :lol:  :lol: ... it is more likely to be fast and effective in stopping this particular antic but cannot guarantee there will be no substitute anti-social behaviour.

 

I simply cannot believe the lengths some people go to and feel no shame in their actions.

 

I would catch the neighbour's action on CCTV, as Geoman suggests, and post it on You Tube - you're likely to get a record number of hits.

 

Anyhow, it's comforting to know my NsFH are not alone in throwing dead rats and rubbish over the fence into my garden alongside stink bombs and training their cats to pooh in my territory - one day I'd like to get all such neighbours together in the same vicinity; they are likely to get on like a house on fire!


Edited by angee, 12 March 2014 - 10:09 PM.

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#8
ravenswood67

Posted 13 March 2014 - 09:20 AM

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Thank you so much everyone, for the suggestions on how to deal with it and for making me feel that I'm not alone in this.  It makes such a difference.  I think a camera may be the way to go, placed so it just covers my doorstep.  I have to admit to being sorely tempted by Crezz's idea though. 

 

There seems to be something of a division in their behaviour since I reported them.  The wife passed us at the washing line today and made a big deal out of deliberately not closing the gate but the husband closed it quietly when he went to work.  Strange.

 

Anyway, the sun is shining today so I'm going to escape to the seaside for a break from the horrendous pair of them.

 

Love to you all and thank you once again for your support x


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#9
Sky2

Posted 13 March 2014 - 10:56 AM

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They are individuals- perhaps the man wants a quiet life and doesn't admire his wife's actions? Perhaps she actually doesn't realize it's the cats/ foxes that are fouling the garden? If it's a communal garden, you can't film it to show her that she's, 'barking up the wrong tree' and that it's the cats parents that she should be targeting. How about trying a cat and dog deterrent in the garden, that way you will be demonstrating that you don't want pets pooing in the communal garden either? Whatever you decide, she is wrong for her actions.



#10
ravenswood67

Posted 25 March 2014 - 07:56 PM

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Hi again.

 

The housing officer has been to visit them and told them not to speak to or approach us in the future.  They have also been warned against using racist abuse and have agreed that they were in the wrong over leaving excrement on our doorstep and won't do it again.

 

I hope things calm down now.

 

Thanks everyone and best wishes x


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#11
fullcircle

Posted 25 March 2014 - 10:08 PM

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It will certainly help you as they have admitted to doing it


  • celestina likes this

For 14 years I've heard, trust us we'll fix it, but I am still waiting filled with empty promises.
14 years of my CCTV, of nfh causing criminal damage, abuse,lies, assault, and not one conviction,why?
If the Law is the same for everyone, why does the outcome depend on who you are?


#12
celestina

Posted 26 March 2014 - 07:23 AM

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Don't forget to log it all - the council officers name, date and time of visit and what s/he told you happened etc... just in case. I do hope that will be an end to it.


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'The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing' (Edmund Burke)

#13
ravenswood67

Posted 27 March 2014 - 08:48 AM

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Good point Celestina, I've just done it, thank you x


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#14
Sky2

Posted 27 March 2014 - 07:29 PM

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Wow- they admitted it. It's a good sign that they have, at least, been reasonable enough to admit it.



#15
ravenswood67

Posted 30 March 2014 - 09:02 AM

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Hi all

 

It seems they have discovered more faeces in the gardens and are again blaming us for it.  This has come to my knowledge second hand via another neighbour (its all getting a bit silly) and that they intend to report us to the Dog Warden.  They say (the NFH) that they have photos of the faeces and intend to use them as evidence against us.  We KNOW its not our dog since we don't let him out in the garden at all.  Is anyone able to tell us what our rights are regarding the Dog Warden?  Will we have to provide proof that our dog isn't responsible and how on earth do we do this if that's what's required.  Any advice would be appreciated, thanks so much x


Edited by ravenswood67, 30 March 2014 - 09:26 AM.


#16
Sky2

Posted 30 March 2014 - 10:45 AM

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In law- you are supposed to be classes as innocent until proven guilty, but that's not how the council works. You could get in first and contact the dog warden yourself and ask them how you can prove that it is not you.



#17
celestina

Posted 30 March 2014 - 11:04 AM

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A photo of poo is not enough evidence - as you say, it's not your dog then that's your defence. The dog warden will need video evidence of your dog doing the deed and/or independent witness (not associated with your NFH) for anything to happen. Explain the NFH situation to the dog warden if what NFH is saying is true (it maybe a scare tactic - a lie) - they do this hoping it will get back to you - in this case it has.

 

Try not to worry about it - I am sure the dog warden will understand - it's not your dog and that's what you say. Do not sign anything or accept any responsibility - good luck and do let us how it goes.


'The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing' (Edmund Burke)

#18
ravenswood67

Posted 30 March 2014 - 11:42 AM

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Once again thanks so much for your help.  I feel a lot more reassured.  I will speak to the Dog Warden tomorrow if I can and thank you Celestina for the advice concerning admitting and signing anything. 

 

I always feel strengthened after I've talked to you all, much love to everyone (and especially the Mums today) xxx


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#19
celestina

Posted 31 March 2014 - 08:58 AM

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You are welcome - we have the issue of neighbours letting their dogs poo in a specific area - we now have a witness - we know who's doing it but getting the evidence is the problem. I have taken pictures of the poo but again, this is not enough as it could easily be argued the poo is not from their dogs. Don't worry and stick to your guns - explain about bags of poo being left and what the officials have said etc... explain in a very calm and reasonable way and you'll be fine :)


'The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing' (Edmund Burke)

#20
angee

Posted 31 March 2014 - 10:07 AM

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It looks like there will need to be a 'post-mortem' analysis of the actual poo and compared with your dog's poo - as others have said, photographs are simply not enough.

 

It is not surprising this is happening; it was too good to be true that they had previously admitted leaving poo on your doorstep.  

I would not trust them; it is clear they were biding time and had no intention of letting it go.

They seem intent on creating trouble and conflict.

 

If I were you, I would log the times your dog does its pooh, even take a photo of it and another one where you have scooped it up --- this could be another method of approach that could possibly help you in your defence; in that way, you are perhaps also showing the pooh is different to the one in your neighbour's garden.  How do they know it's a dog's pooh? Could it be a fox's business for instance, just a thought?


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